PepTalkHer Founder & CEO Meggie Palmer spoke with Loren Trlin on how to maintain an abundant mindset during a crisis. Loren shared her journey, her best practices in staying positive in whatever circumstance, and how she reframed an awful experience into an opportunity.
What is the best way to maintain an abundant mindset right now?
Managing our uncertainty through certainty practices
Loren: Yeah, so the biggest thing we can do at the moment is managing our uncertainty. So one of the two core fundamental human needs that we have is the needs of certainty. And at the moment, uncertainty has gone through the roof. And so we need to manage that through certainty practices.
What that looks like on a really, really practical level is daily ritual bringing back out the daily ritual that most people have probably lost if they're not going to work anymore if their whole schedule has been thrown out. So we want to bring some of that back.
Meditation practices
So for me, morning, meditation practices are non-negotiable. Simple, like a simple practice, like that, keeps me certain brings me groundedness, and then having some form of schedule really, really helps. And all of this helps to manage the uncertainty. And as soon as we manage the uncertainty, we can bring ourselves out of fight or flight mode. And then we can start to get creative, start to think outside the box start to come up with ideas for how we can potentially solve our problems. So yeah, that's the first piece of that puzzle.
Like maybe I should put my lipstick on because I haven't done that today. So that's like a good ratio. I feel like a lot of people are working remotely and they're working from home and they're not cycling or walking or getting the subway or the bus or driving to work right like this stuck at home. And so I think probably a lot of people are making excuses like I know I am for the reasons that I haven't created a ritual, not sticking to it. Like I wrote one down. I just did it for like two days, and then I haven't been sticking to it.
What are great ways that we can make it a genuine habit? Do we utilize this time to build up a daily habit or practice?
Loren: Yeah, so make it fun. We forget that we get to make it fun. Like I actually rearrange my entire home office a couple of days ago to shift the energy around to make it a place that felt really, really inviting. A ton of my clients has done this because all of a sudden, that corner of the house that wasn't really looked at ever has become a home office. So that's a great way like humans love to have it and something practical to do.
So if that means that you just have to create an office space for yourself, that's a really, really inviting, or meditation space where you can relax on your own. Take the time to do that, even if it takes a couple of days to do that.
And so fun is really, really, really important. And also creating, being curious bringing back energy of curiosity, asking yourself, like, I wonder what it would look like if I was to go do this. I wonder what the next version of me requires for this next phase of my life that we're all entering as human beings. I wonder how like now that I have the opportunity to completely change my life in many respects, I wonder what I want to invite in for the next phase of my life. And maybe that's something that is practical and simple as more fun. More laughter, less stress. You know, we've been very stressed out as a collective for a very, very long time, more ease, more simplicity. And so we should definitely spend some time reflecting on that because that's why we're having this experience at the moment.
“Fun is really, really, really important and also creating, being curious bringing back the energy of curiosity.”
Meggie: And so for people who I think I think haven't been able to create the headspace to make a home office, like I was, we had an email this morning from someone who's homeschooling three children. And she and her partner both have, you know, fairly intense jobs. So I think there's a lot of people out there who kind of just feeling overwhelmed. And I totally hear you, unlike finding the curiosity and making the space beautiful, but like practically for people who feel like that's just not an option for them, like what are some ways that people can kind of like really slow down and create that space, even amidst all of the kind of, you know, ups and downs that are happening right now.
Loren: Okay, and so it's a really good point because we will have time though if we're not competing anymore. Everyone has 15 minutes. And so even if it's a small act. Before I actually meditate before I get out of bed so that I don't have any excuses. And if that means that I just get up 15 minutes earlier, or get out of bed 50 minutes later.
The great thing is no one's chasing a bus or subway at the moment, in order to be able to do that, then we need to create nonnegotiables in our life. And so part of it is that it's not really a matter of time, it's a matter of prioritization.
“It’s not really a matter of time, it’s a matter of prioritization. ”
And I would suggest that anyone that you know, despite the fact that I've got a lot of friends that have like three kids hanging off them at the moment, and it's I know, it's like wild out there, that that that daily groundedness practice needs to become a non-negotiable not just for yourself, but you need to give it a higher purpose. If it feels like you can't justify that for yourself, justify it for your family, because your kids will benefit from you having 15 minutes to yourself. I'd be like sitting in the bathtub, we'll have a quick meditation, even if it means like journaling or taking a bit of time to tidy up your space. Everyone benefits from it.
So if you're feeling any guilt, guilt is always a sign that I am doing something wrong. Tell a different story around it. That's it. We're just storytellers, right. So if the story is that I'm a terrible parent, tell a better story. Tell a story that is sweet, makes me a better parent to a some of that guilt and any concern we might have around, you know, being able to give that time to ourselves because it's really fundamental. Yeah.
Meggie: Yeah. And it's, you know, it's funny, I think what I'm hearing you say is that like, it's really it's an excuse or as a story, we're telling ourselves if we're not taking the time for it. I actually read something on Twitter this morning. I'm trying to cut back on Twitter. It is an awful addiction for those of you who are like me and suffer from it. But the woman from the main character in House of Cards to anyone who's seen it, um, she put out a tweet that's like being retweeted, like 4000 times or something. And it essentially said, I guess I can stop telling myself that these are all the things that I do if I had time, right, because we now all have the time. And I don't know about you, but my to-do list is still pretty long. So that's obviously not due to a lack of capacity or time to do it, but due to the priorities that I'm setting.
“We are actually being asked to stop, pause and reflect. ”
Loren: You know, I had to actually revisit my to-do list a couple of days ago and look at it and be like, really? Does half of this stuff need to be on here? And the answer is no. Really. And so this is actually a great time. Like think about it collectively, we've been asked to stop, pause and reflect whether we realize it or not, whether we're still gonna, if we're still in panic mode, that's totally fine. It's a very normal response. But we are actually being asked to stop, pause and reflect. And it's the perfect time before things the pace lifts up again, which inevitably will for us to ask ourselves, is this actually important? Is this necessary? And is this going to be relevant to my life 12 months from now, five years from now if it's not taken off the to-do list?
Meggie: I just want to acknowledge the people out there who are really stressed right now and who have lost their jobs and who have family members who are sick. I just want to send compassion and empathy to you because you know, I really appreciate, and I can empathize that this must be an incredibly challenging time for a lot of people, and particularly businesses who are kind of struggling and require the economy to be open.
For people who are gonna find it hard to get their head around as their business has had to shut out, or they've had to sack staff this week…
Is there merit in people reframing this away from a negative and towards an opportunity?
Loren: Completely, and it's a really good point. So that's like the next phase and all of this once we have settled, and so I don't advocate pushing too much onto an individual if they're because whatever they're experiencing is incredibly valid.
So if you're feeling incredibly stressed out at the moment, and all of that completely valid, but then when we reach the point where we have come to accept our circumstances, we then have two options. We either continue the way that hasn't been working for us or we find a new way. And so that's a really important aspect. To this whole journey is that what's going to be required from so many of us and I went through this in 2011, I went through my own personal family tragedy, and my family nearly lost everything. And I went through a severe amount of stress for a good 18 months. And so what emerged from that was it I had to completely recreate myself and to create a whole new set of beliefs around the stories that I was telling myself that no longer serve me.
“Back in 2011, was that, you know, regardless of what life threw at me, I had the ability to decide that I was on a hero’s journey.”
So this is actually an awesome opportunity. Because once again, we're meaning-making machines. We're powerful storytellers. So the question becomes, am I going to tell a story that's going to lead me to an outcome that I don't want. And this can be incredibly difficult to wrap your head around because the story feels so convincing. The fear feels so convincing, right? Or we can tell a better story that says “Actually, this is just a part of my hero's journey. And I know that I have the resourcefulness, the capacity, the love, and support to always find a way.”
And that was one really big thing that I realized Back in 2011, was that, you know, regardless of what life threw at me, I had the ability to decide that I was on a hero's journey. And I got to every time I came across a belief, which might be that you're a failure, you're not capable, you're not going to make it through this, I had the opportunity to tell a better story. So this is a really, really important aspect of it's like, what kind of stories are going through our head at the moment? And while they may seem convincing, are they actually real and valid?
Meggie: No, I really appreciate you sharing that part of your story. Loren and I met a couple of years ago, we actually shared a WeWork office, years ago in Sydney before we both moved to the United States. And I think the power of you sharing your story, and we won't have time to go into it now. But you know, I think you sort of touched on there that as a family and as an individual and as a professional, you went through enormous upheaval and the lowest of blows. And yet, you don't you're grateful for that. It's “experience now” because you know, that's led you to where you are.
How did you go through that process of reframing that most awful experience in your family's life to where it's led you now?
Loren: Yeah, if we look at any age, human story, right, there are always peaks and troughs. And if we look at nature, nature always ebbs and flows. And so if we can buy into this illusion that you know, things are always going to move on a linear path upwards, they don't mean look at what the economy does as well. And so if we can accept that those troughs are required in order for us to create our next peak, then we can start to learn to ride the wave of life.
And so for me, it was always a question of like, I'm, in some respects, I feel like I'm seeing a full circle come around with what I experienced in 2011. I can see that it's happening again on a collective planetary level this time around. And the great thing for me to have been able to reflect on is that how much I've grown from the experience, how much this time around, I feel a much greater sense of calm how because I've done a lot of the self-development and mindset work.
I'm not anxiety-ridden like I was the first time around. I was like losing my hair, losing weight, everything when I genuinely thought it was the end of the world. So in hindsight, in order for me to stand here today, in a place where like, I feel like my business is doing well, my family's doing well, we couldn't have gotten here if it wasn't for the experience that we had in 2011.
So I look back at that period of time. And despite the fact that I had my greatest challenges at that period of time, I would never take them away because they've made me who I am today. And that in some respects, like if we view it for one lens, like that level of growth is only something that can serve us time and time and time again in our life. If we've come through at once we can come through it again. If we have learned how to make money in a trough, or two how to survive in a trough the great thing is like when the peak comes out way will be really ready for it.
So there's a ton of opportunity that's available here, even in the midst of a lot of suffering, even in the midst of a lot of challenges for a lot of people. But I'm also a massive believer that the human experience is one of like having to go through our own challenges in order to realize how resilient and powerful we are. So we can't take that away from anyone. We can't take that away from someone that's supposed to have this experience. Because, you know, if we reflect on our own lives, many of us have been through challenges, and they've made us resilient. So can we take that away and say, like, Oh, I wish that wasn't happening to you if it's going to be the best gift that comes your way? I don't think so. So it's, you know, we have to look at it from multiple angles, even though like when we're in the midst of it is really, really, really hard to do. So.
Meggie: Yeah, I think that's so true. It's kind of like that concept when they say, you know, that idea of being a helicopter parent and I don't have children, but from what I understand when you're a helicopter parent, you kind of always solving your children's problems, but actually at some point, I made to fail, and I need to hit rock bottom and they need to build themselves off on their own. So I can kind of stay some synergies between what you're saying and that analogy as well.
You mentioned that you did a lot of work and that you have a lot of growth in the past 10 years. So for people who are at the start of that kind of growth journey in moving towards a more abundant mindset and finding opportunities, even in kind of dark times, like the world's experiencing now, what are some really practical things that people can do like right now or like tomorrow? So you mentioned routine and making a choice every day prioritizing good things?
Are there other practical things that people can put into practice today?
Loren: Completely. I think it's really, really important to find a group of people that have high energy that are not going to bring you down, especially if you're currently surrounded by like, I don't know about you, but when I go out, the energy is not great out there. It's doom and gloom, right.
So what's really beautiful is that a lot of like virtual coffee meetups are happening at the moment for people to come together. So that's a freeway that we can choose to catch up with one another, share our experiences collectively and come together and pull our heads together and get creative around how we're going to navigate these times. So that's one really easy way to do it. There's a ton of them popping up at the moment.
If you can't find one yourself, start one. There are no rules, right? So if you're not seeing it, then just be the leader when it comes to that. The next piece around the seeds for me, I'm a massive believer that we're not designed to do this on our own. We're human. And so we have to you and I have talked about this extensively.
We need to surround ourselves with people that can facilitate that journey for us. So back when I started, back in 2011, I didn't realize that I was suffering from some form of like trauma and mental health issues. And so my boss at the time when I was working at the law firm recommended that I go see a psychologist because he had also lost his daughter. And so it never came. It never popped into my mind that that was actually something that I should or could do.
And so that's how my self-development journey began. Because I started seeing a psychologist she helped me. It was really helpful to have an observer from the outside look in on my circumstances, this could be a therapist, this could be a coach, whatever it is a healer. And that was how I got into the journey of firstly starting to recognize that I'm not my emotions. I am not the stories that I'm telling myself. And it just allowed me breathing space to realize that so that I could start to recreate myself because it felt like I had hit rock bottom. So yeah, those are some recommendations of that.
And actually, the way that we met was, well, it was through the office space that we share. But you then brought me very kindly into a group of women entrepreneurs, who you know, I'm still in contact with every day now and we've kind of formed our own little support crew a couple of years ago that that that is still maintained today. And I think, honestly, I don't know about you, but like I would not have been able to make the leaps of faith that I did. We'll make the growth in revenue or hire staff or expand into some of our fortune 500 clients had it not been for the support of that group. So I really that really resonates with me when you talk about the power of that group and community around you.
Meggie: One of the things, Lauren, that you've taught me is the power of understanding and finding your zone of genius, which I'm going to guess is linked to abundance as well. But can you just for people who are not familiar with that term, a phrase that you've coined?
Can you talk us through the power of understanding and finding your zone of genius?
Loren: Yeah. So when I think of genius, I think of it as this unique pot of ingredients that is uniquely you. And so it could be the skills that you've acquired over the course of your lifetime, the lessons you've learned the experiences that you've had on this like journey of life, it could be the things that you have learned formally or informally. It's your particular energy that you have personality traits when we wrap all of that up. That is your union. So genius.
And so what happens and what has happened and what many people are currently experiencing is that they might be losing a job, but they never even really like to begin with. But there's still grief and loss associated with it, right? And so what this actually is, is a perfect opportunity for us to take stock and be like, is this actually what I want to be doing? Like, you know, for example, I was a litigation lawyer for a number of years. And it wasn't until I had that catalyst event that I really called that into the question asked myself is this how I want to be living my life? Is this the best use of my resources and time and in the five years since then, I actually realized I want to be helping people on a human behavioral level, serving them, and being able to have flexibility running my business. So I went and did that. And so I think there's an awesome opportunity.
Meggie: Yeah, I love that I just like it's funny for me. She says that she used to be a litigation lawyer because it's like so contrary to how I know you be and why I know what I know you love doing.
I just wanted to give you an opportunity to talk to people about some of the programs that you're running and people who kind of align to find more abundance and really move into that zone of genius, like, obviously, you've got a lot of content online, but I know you run courses as well. Is there anything that you kind of wanted to talk everyone through from that?
Loren: Yeah. So for me the fundamental pinnacles of new creating our definition of abundance, finding money, experience, whether that be your work or business. So I do a lot of business coaching, helping startup founders and people that want to get into the business, launch their business and grow because I think that's a powerful tool for creating abundance and freedom in our life. So I assist a lot of people with that.
But then on the other side of it, I also focus on mindset and abundance, because I'm a firm believer that 90% of our success comes from what we're thinking. And so I also have courses one of them being one of them is called the abundant alchemists, which is all-around shifting our mindset so that we can transform our lives.
I think part of what I love to do is make all of this as practical as possible take like there any sort of like airiness out of it and make it very like strategic on a day to day basis as to how we can apply it in our life. So the way that I help people is either you know that mindset is the piece that you want to start in or you know that business is the place where you want to start. Regardless, I've got online courses and programs for both of them. So if anyone knows that, like now is the time for them to really firstly step into their leadership of what it's going to look like for them in their life. And they know that they're either ready to run a business or to grow one online then they're very welcome to get in touch with me. I love this stuff. Really, really lights me up I get super excited when someone wants to write because I think like your passion really shines through
Meggie: We have this Facebook group, it's called The Coven. I don't know why it's called that but it is and there's probably about eight of us on there. And I think I actually did this I think the other day I was like, “hey, like, what is up? How's everyone going or something like that?” It was like it was very negative. I have to be honest, I didn't feel that negative. But I guess I was just putting and assuming that everyone was feeling negative, like one or two of the women write back there like “yeah, like this sucks.” And I was like, “Oh gosh, what are we gonna do?” And Lauren was like, “No, no, this is amazing like what an opportunity! Who's feeling amazing? Who's feeling fabulous?” And I was like “What?! Fabulous who's feeling fabulous during a global pandemic?” And then I realized that it's like that's your MR. And you're choosing to make that choice every single minute.
Loren: Very deliberate choice. It's no, I don't… I can't see the reality of what's unfolding. I'm very much tuned into it. But it's also what we all have choices, right? So it's a very deliberate choice as to like the story that we get to tell ourselves and I want to be the example of that because we can't all be doom and gloom. Otherwise, we're never going to get out of this hole together.
Meggie: Yeah. And so I need to thank you because you really wrenched me out of whatever sort of momentary negative lapse I was in. As I said, in my head I didn't think I was being that negative. But when you were so positive, it made me reflect that actually, my behavior was not coming from a positive place. And it could be.
And actually, for us at PepTalkHer, like, we're so fortunate in that, you know, I'm similar to you, I built this business because I wanted to have a choice. And I want to have geographic freedom, and my team works remotely anyway. And what a blessing that I'm able to continue to do the work that we do from quarantine here in Australia instead of my apartment in New York, where I would typically be so yeah, lots of positives to come from there.
I want to thank you, Loren, because you've really helped me shift my mindset through being friends with you and being in your community. So I'm just thrilled that we're able to bring this to the PepTalkHer community. And yeah, I'm just I think that you're doing great work and why and I'm glad you're not a litigation lawyer anymore.
Loren: Insane, right? It was a really smart move by Loren from five years ago. And so we have to honor ourselves because we're going to make some really smart decisions now and the next coming month like for anyone that's listening to this, and I'm ready to recognize like how capable you are how resilient Oh, I have this motto. I'm like, this is not my first rodeo. And I keep saying I'm like, this isn't my first rodeo. Like, I've got this. We've got it.
Meggie: You can check out Loren’s work at lorentrlin.com. She actually also has a podcast and sometimes like, everyone has a podcast. It's a bit annoying. But I'm pretty harsh because I used to be journalists. And I can tell you, Loren’s podcast is excellent. I remember what I ran you off. And I was like, I was like, I'm trying to be harsh because I want to give you constructive feedback. And I was like, I have no constructive view. I think it's excellent. Thank you. Excellent podcast, so you can download that as well.
You can check out more info on Loren here.